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azcat34
07-25-2004, 07:43 PM
The trade countdown is officially on after tonight's game.

I am sure when Colangelo comes back from Italy, the unit will sit down and they will come to an agreement a trade is best for him

The question is to where?

My guess is Anaheim.

S.O.

Irish27
07-25-2004, 09:12 PM
I think Randy will either be traded to the Angels before the deadline or traded in the offseason.

BJ#10
07-25-2004, 11:28 PM
Here's hoping for the offseason...

ZONACAT
07-26-2004, 01:43 AM
That the Angels have offered Kotchman to the Pirates for Benson. This is by far the best deal the Bucs have recieved and I would be surprised if this did not happen if the RJ deal goes thru.

Also, the Angels are preparing a offer to the Snakes within the next couple of days that will center around Mathis, another one of their big- time prospects.

If the Angels got Benson and RJ, which is within the realm of possibility, they will be in great shape to finnish strong. Problem is, mortgaging your future is never a great idea.

Morgan
07-26-2004, 03:25 AM
Originally posted by ZONACAT
That the Angels have offered Kotchman to the Pirates for Benson. This is by far the best deal the Bucs have recieved and I would be surprised if this did not happen if the RJ deal goes thru.

Also, the Angels are preparing a offer to the Snakes within the next couple of days that will center around Mathis, another one of their big- time prospects.

If the Angels got Benson and RJ, which is within the realm of possibility, they will be in great shape to finnish strong. Problem is, mortgaging your future is never a great idea.

I'd be shocked beyond belief if the Angels made two deals at the deadline. Bill Stoneman has made exactly two deals at the deadline as the Angels GM. He acquired Alex Ochoa in 2002 and some dude in 2000 who i don't remember.

I would support the Kotchman deal, the kid can't stay healthy, but he is on the DL again. He went right back on the DL after being on the shelf for 18 games. I wouldn't support a deal for RJ. Too many guys would have to be involved for a 41 year old.

Morgan
07-26-2004, 03:26 AM
Oh and they better not trade Dallas Macpherson.

DavidImmel
07-26-2004, 04:35 AM
DM isn't going anywhere, especially considering Glaus is a free agent after this year. Randy Johnson isn't going anywhere either, IMO.

wosn99
07-26-2004, 10:16 AM
Originally posted by DavidImmel
DM isn't going anywhere, especially considering Glaus is a free agent after this year. Randy Johnson isn't going anywhere either, IMO.


Gotta agree there. The DBacks will have to absolutely be blown away to make the trade and have some pretty solid prospects to show to fans that they do in fact no how to make an even trade. The Angels seem to be the only team with the necessary prospects but don't really want to deal them. I heard a rumor that the Dodgers have emerged as a darkhorse candidate for Johnson but Colangelo would be out of his mind to deal Randy in the division. Oh, well the Dbacks are going to stink next year so what the hell. the Dodgers would have to give up a lot and they don't havve a lot in AAA, just Koyie Hill, Edwin Jackson, and maybe the Taiwanese sensation CHEN FENG CHEN!!!!! I don't see the DBacks foaming at the mouth over him. Quick, someone tell Garagiola that this kid has all 5 tools, wait no, 6 TOOLS! He will have to go for that...

Morgan
07-26-2004, 03:01 PM
Originally posted by DavidImmel
DM isn't going anywhere, especially considering Glaus is a free agent after this year. Randy Johnson isn't going anywhere either, IMO.

Glaus will be moved to first base. He'll be back with the Halos, but I think they are worried about his throwing arm.

DavidImmel
07-26-2004, 03:19 PM
If Glaus is moving to 1B, where is Erstad going to play now that the outfield is set for years to come? You can't tell me with all that ability with the glove that Darin will be a DH. If anything Glaus will be the DH which is a shame because he's got a lot of talent in the field. I agree that they'll re-sign Glaus and then worry about these things later. The one prospect they'll probably deal is Jeff Mathis because Bengie is already established as the best defensive catcher in the game, and is a consistent .285-.295 hitter.

Morgan
07-26-2004, 03:30 PM
Erstad would be traded. He isn't really a traditional 1B anyway. I like his toughness and intangibles, but he wasn't hitting at all until this year and his power has never equaled that great year in 2000 or 99. Glaus could be the DH too I guess. When is Salmons contract up? I hope he retires as an Angel. I think he has 1 more year after this one.

In 2006 you have GA and Vlad as your corner outfielders and Glaus and Macpherson as your corner infielders. Put Chone at second and find a decent SS.


EDIT: I meant that Salmon had one more year on his contract, not one more good year left.

stewbacka
07-26-2004, 03:48 PM
Unless the Angels, Cubs or someother club with MLB rady prospects comes in he is not going any where IMO. If another owner is willing to dump 2-3 propects to the Yankkess for CASH and then the MLB oks it he could end up in NY.

Keep RJ sign a number 3-4 starter in offseason and a vet reliever.
A rotation of
RJ
Webb
Solid FA
Villareal
Gonzalez

with a lineup of
RF Terrero
2b Hairston
LF Gonzo
1b Sexson
CF Finley
3B Cintron
SS Santos
C Brito

Could contend in the NL west next year if healthy not too mention more teams would be in the biding pool for RJ with him not having 17 mill on the books for the following season.

DavidImmel
07-26-2004, 03:51 PM
No chance Steve Finley is in Arizona this time next week, and you're off-base if you think the D-backs will come close to contending next season.

MinorThreat22
07-26-2004, 04:21 PM
Erstad isn't really an everyday player anymore. I doubt that he'll be traded as he's way overpaid. He's due 16.5 mil over the next 2 seasons, which is a lot for an injury prone utility man. Unless someone offers Glaus huge cash, he'll be back as the Angels 1B next season, and McPherson, who I don't think they'll move, would play 3rd.

Morgan
07-26-2004, 04:29 PM
Originally posted by MinorThreat22
Erstad isn't really an everyday player anymore. I doubt that he'll be traded as he's way overpaid. He's due 16.5 mil over the next 2 seasons, which is a lot for an injury prone utility man. Unless someone offers Glaus huge cash, he'll be back as the Angels 1B next season, and McPherson, who I don't think they'll move, would play 3rd.

I agree about Erstad. I thought he made 5 million per. I figure someone (Joe G. Jr.?) would want to move him back to CF and they could move him. Hopefully at least.

stewbacka
07-26-2004, 04:52 PM
Maybe I am way off but I am not a big time D Back fan and I was told that about the D Rays finishing third this year. I bet everyone here knew the Rangers would be in first right now.
I know that Finley won't be here after the deadline but he will be here in 05. You give the DBacks a healthy Sexson and Gonzo with a closer and they can be at least a 500 team. The team is a mess right now no doubt but they have enough of the right peices to be put back together with the right manager to contend for WC or even a weak division.

MinorThreat22
07-26-2004, 08:26 PM
Originally posted by stewbacka
Maybe I am way off but I am not a big time D Back fan and I was told that about the D Rays finishing third this year. I bet everyone here knew the Rangers would be in first right now.
I know that Finley won't be here after the deadline but he will be here in 05. You give the DBacks a healthy Sexson and Gonzo with a closer and they can be at least a 500 team. The team is a mess right now no doubt but they have enough of the right peices to be put back together with the right manager to contend for WC or even a weak division.

You're right in that anything can happen, but they have a lot of things working against them.

1. Gonzo is going to have ligament replacement surgery at the ripe age of 37. His return is dicey at best.

2. Even if Unit makes it past the deadline, there's just as good of a chance that he gets traded in the offseason.

3. It's not a sure bet that Sexson will be back.

4. If they'll let him, Fins will retire in SD.

5. There closer will either be Brunney, or Valverde, and neither will be confused with Mariano.

6. Even if they keep RJ, Villarreal, and Gonzalez have been brutal this year.

7. Cintron has shown that he's a lot closer to the Minor Leaguer that we've known for the last 5 years than the Major Leaguer he was last season.

IMO, the D-backs have way too much to overcome to even think about competing. If they get a couple of prospects for the Unit, and Finley, then they'll have a good start on the rebuilding with Hairston, and Tracy.

Irish27
07-26-2004, 08:42 PM
Stew, I think Tracy will be playing third base next year, not Santos. Santos will be up in 2006 at short. I think there is a chance the Diamondbacks can contend in the weak NL West next year if they can get some key personnel. I really believe they're two years away with Santos, Conor Jackson and Carlos Quentin.

Class of 1990
07-26-2004, 08:52 PM
I read somewhere recently is the problem with AZ that they rushed too many guys to the majors. Granted they have had an incredible amount of injuries.

Giving up all of those players for Sexton hurts more not because of Sexton injury but the FIVE everyday players they gave up.

AZ has a great farm system but these guys are coming through too fast and the results are right in front of us.
________
St. louis assembly (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/St._Louis_Assembly)

stewbacka
07-26-2004, 09:05 PM
I was told by a local media member that Jackson, Quentin and Santos will be here in September. I think Santos is their best option next year at SS. Tracey is not very impressive to me. I think they move Cintron over to 3rd but I think he will end up being a Wil Cordero type guy. So obviously I am not big on Cintron either. Villareal has been hurt and if you are writing off a couple of young pitchers because of a couple of bad months fine. How are Bonderman and Maroth looking this year? IMO Sexson is back here most of the signs point to that. Gonzo's elbow was good enough to try to play with hurt then I would imagine a repaired one would be an upgrade. I am not saying this team would win 95 games. But 78-85 is a possibilty and that would keep fans coming out and revenue coming in. After all most of these DBack fans thought they had a chance last year. I would think the chances of them bringing in a few vets to help Valverdel and Bruney is very possible once they get Mantie off the books. Bring in Guardardo (He has a funky deal he might be a FA) for example. I have no problems with them dealing Randy but why for one prospect? That is all they really got for Schill (Del La Rosa) and that has been a disaster PR wise. They need to get 2 guys that can help them next year or they need to keep him until they can get that for him.

Morgan
07-26-2004, 10:26 PM
who would have thought that the D-Backs are hoping to be next years Detroit Tigers.

DavidImmel
07-26-2004, 11:31 PM
Originally posted by MinorThreat22
Erstad isn't really an everyday player anymore.
What? Not an Angel fan, huh? He just turned 30 and he plays every day. If they keep him at first, he'll win a Gold Glove, and he's still got 1,000 hits or more in his bat before he retires.

Irish27
07-26-2004, 11:34 PM
Originally posted by stewbacka
I was told by a local media member that Jackson, Quentin and Santos will be here in September. I think Santos is their best option next year at SS. Tracey is not very impressive to me. I think they move Cintron over to 3rd but I think he will end up being a Wil Cordero type guy. So obviously I am not big on Cintron either. Villareal has been hurt and if you are writing off a couple of young pitchers because of a couple of bad months fine. How are Bonderman and Maroth looking this year? IMO Sexson is back here most of the signs point to that. Gonzo's elbow was good enough to try to play with hurt then I would imagine a repaired one would be an upgrade. I am not saying this team would win 95 games. But 78-85 is a possibilty and that would keep fans coming out and revenue coming in. After all most of these DBack fans thought they had a chance last year. I would think the chances of them bringing in a few vets to help Valverdel and Bruney is very possible once they get Mantie off the books. Bring in Guardardo (He has a funky deal he might be a FA) for example. I have no problems with them dealing Randy but why for one prospect? That is all they really got for Schill (Del La Rosa) and that has been a disaster PR wise. They need to get 2 guys that can help them next year or they need to keep him until they can get that for him.

Tracy is better than Cintron. Tracy has hit 300 at every level in the minors. Cintron is a below fielder and I am not a big fan of switch hitters. Maybe he can turn it around but I would rather have Tracy than Cintron at third. If the Diamondbacks sign Sexson and don't trade Shea, Hillenbrand will start at third anyway.

As for the pitching staff, I like Villareal but Brenly killed this guy last year. It seemed like he pitched every day. The bullpen needs a major overhaul. Mantei is gone, hopefully a sucker will trade for him this week. Valverde or Bruney will be the closer, and those two really don't make the opposition shake in their pants. I hope Koplove can turn things around because he sure has not pitched like he has in the past. If RJ is gone Webb is the #1 and then who knows. De La Rosa was dealt in the Sexson trade and Fossum has been a bust. De La Rosa has not done well at all in the Brewers triple A team this year so him and Fossum are a wash. Lance Cormier(acquired in the Schilling trade) has potential but needs to stay healthy. I keep waiting for Gosling to get things together but it has not happened yet. Edgar Gonzalez is still young(22 years old) and has a lot of talent. He has pitched very well in Tucson the last month but did not look good last week for the Diamondbacks. This team will need to pickup a pitcher or two in the offseason and they can't get a has been like Shane Reynolds.

I think they can maybe win 75 games next year but it depends on who they get and who the manager will be. Mark Grace would be a huge mistake.

Morgan
07-26-2004, 11:53 PM
Originally posted by DavidImmel
What? Not an Angel fan, huh? He just turned 30 and he plays every day. If they keep him at first, he'll win a Gold Glove, and he's still got 1,000 hits or more in his bat before he retires.

actually, with the exception of 2000 when he had a 950 OPS he really has been a rather average player. I admit that I'm not a big fan of his, but he has become J.T. Snow with not quite the same D. At 7.75 per year, we should demand more.

WilmasPimp
07-26-2004, 11:57 PM
Jose Contreras was bumped up a day in the MFY rotation and is now pitching Thursday on 3 days rest. Conspiracy theory has it that this was to make room for Randy, whose next start will be on Friday.

stewbacka
07-27-2004, 12:54 AM
Or Brown coming off the DL.

I know De la Rosa was moved it that Brewers deal that was my point about the PR significance of moving RJ without getting a legit return. If the Angels give the Catcher mathis and a solid pair of A-AA pitchers I could see it going down if RJ OK'd it.

MinorThreat22
07-27-2004, 12:50 PM
Originally posted by stewbacka
I was told by a local media member that Jackson, Quentin and Santos will be here in September. I think Santos is their best option next year at SS. Tracey is not very impressive to me. I think they move Cintron over to 3rd but I think he will end up being a Wil Cordero type guy. So obviously I am not big on Cintron either. Villareal has been hurt and if you are writing off a couple of young pitchers because of a couple of bad months fine. How are Bonderman and Maroth looking this year? IMO Sexson is back here most of the signs point to that. Gonzo's elbow was good enough to try to play with hurt then I would imagine a repaired one would be an upgrade. I am not saying this team would win 95 games. But 78-85 is a possibilty and that would keep fans coming out and revenue coming in. After all most of these DBack fans thought they had a chance last year. I would think the chances of them bringing in a few vets to help Valverdel and Bruney is very possible once they get Mantie off the books. Bring in Guardardo (He has a funky deal he might be a FA) for example. I have no problems with them dealing Randy but why for one prospect? That is all they really got for Schill (Del La Rosa) and that has been a disaster PR wise. They need to get 2 guys that can help them next year or they need to keep him until they can get that for him.

Like I said, anything can happen, but they have a lot of "if's" that need to happen for them to win 75-85 games, and 75 wins won't have them competing for the NL West, no matter how weak the division is perceived. I'm not sure about your Maroth and Bonderman comments. Yeah, they aren't going to lose 20 games this season, but they both still suck. Bonderman has an ERA of almost 6, with a 1.44 WHIP, and Maroth has only been slightly better with a 4.60, and 1.38. If you're hoping that Edgar and Oscar become the next Maroth and Bonderman, then you might be right, but that's not going to do a whole lot for the D-backs. As for me writing them off based on a "couple of bad months," that's not the case. Gonzalez dominated at A ball, but both have been mediocre on every level after that, especially Villarreal. I don't think he's a starting pitcher, at least not a good one.

stewbacka
07-27-2004, 01:46 PM
Villareal was not a good reliever last year until Brenly killed him?

DavidImmel
07-27-2004, 04:02 PM
I've known Conor Jackson since we were kids, and I can assure all of you D-Backs fans that he is going to be a huge star in the Big Leagues. He's a quality guy who should develop more power as the years go along. The best comparison I can think of is to Garret Anderson of the Angels.

Carlos Quentin, believe it or not, played high school basketball at Uni in San Diego on the same team with Mark Prior and Luke Walton. I'm not as convinced about him being a star in the Majors as Conor, but he should be a solid player in the coming years.

azcat34
07-28-2004, 02:45 AM
interning with the San Jose Giants and got to see Conor Jackson and Carlos Quentin on Lancaster and they both are great players.

Carlos Quentin though will be the bigger star of the two. He is amazing.

Also, where does Steve Finley end up now? He has eliminated the Phillies and the Marlins. It looks like he is down to the Dodgers, Giants and Padres. That can't make the Dbacks too happy.

S.O.

stewbacka
07-28-2004, 04:14 AM
Rangers might be a good fit if they get Benson they could involve the DBacks in a 3 way.

ZONACAT
07-28-2004, 11:41 AM
Rangers are not trading for anybody.....Everybody is asking for way too much.

Benson looks like he is going to Minnesota.

MinorThreat22
07-28-2004, 01:10 PM
The latest.

The Denver Post cites a Bergen (N.J.) Record report that Randy Johnson has asked the Diamondbacks to trade him to the Yankees in time for his Friday start.
The Yankees may be employing a third team - possibly the Padres - to close the deal. San Diego would get Steve Finley as part of the 3-way trade, with prospects from both the Yankees and Padres going to Arizona. The Yankees have moved Jose Contreras up a day in rotation in anticipation of Johnson filling Friday's spot. However, there's a lot more to the story: The Yankees are willing to take on the salaries of Roberto Alomar and Matt Mantei, which would free up another $8 million for Arizona. However, the D'Backs are believed to still prefer the Angels' offer, and might force Johnson to take that or nothing. Johnson, meanwhile, is said to be threatening to be a disruptive presence in the clubhouse if forced to stay in Arizona. This could still get ugly before it's resolved. Jul. 28 - 8:09 am et

Chicat
07-28-2004, 01:32 PM
Originally posted by MinorThreat22
Johnson, meanwhile, is said to be threatening to be a disruptive presence in the clubhouse if forced to stay in Arizona. This could still get ugly before it's resolved.
That just doesn't sound plausible. Especially coming from Randy Johnson. The man has always been a class act in my book.

MinorThreat22
07-28-2004, 04:11 PM
Originally posted by Chicat
That just doesn't sound plausible. Especially coming from Randy Johnson. The man has always been a class act in my book.

I agree. It really doesn't seem to be in his nature to be a jerk.

stewbacka
07-30-2004, 03:56 PM
Randy has had lockeroom issues before see Seattle and David Segui before he got dealt. He shot himself out of town ala Barkley then.

Gammons ( more often means not happening) is saying RJ is now mulling over the LA deal we will see.