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View Full Version : The end of the UCLA argument...


NewportCat
08-26-2003, 10:54 PM
Sorry to all UCLA fans but your school sucks and your sports suck. USC is going to kill you guys in football for many years to come and Arizona has your number for basketball, actually so does Stanford and Cal. Your traditions are over and so shut it until you guys get good again. I swear UCLA fans are the worst, why wont they just except the fact that Arizona is better then them and that there school is one of the most over-rated dumps in the country. a UCLA fan is about as much fun as a bout with crabs.

CactusPants
08-26-2003, 11:16 PM
T-minus 5 minutes till the UCLA fans show up.:rolleyes:

SnowCat
08-26-2003, 11:58 PM
>>>The end of the UCLA argument... <<<

Unfortunately, there is no such thing as an end to this argument...

The reason is simple, almost all UA fans acknowledge that UCLA has had the greatest run in NCAABB history, and it will never be surpassed.

UCLA fans on the other hand acknowledge that as well, and like to tell UA fans that they'll never know that level of success.

They're right, UA will never see that level of success - ever. Nor will any other team, anywhere, ever, including UCLA.

UA fans then point out, "that's history", and they're right. It is history. Great history, and will never be repeated. But, as the AZ fans chime in - at this point and time, we are the beter basketball program. And, there is no doubt about it.

UCLA fans will then chime in.... "we have a great coach now". Well, there are very few, if any AZ fans that can't see that UCLA is on the upswing and will rejoin the NCAA elite in basketball in about 2 years.

Everyone with half a brain can acknowlede all that - but the real reason the debate can never go away is becasue there is too much petty "my dad can beat up your dad" 4 year old immature and petty crap.

So, here's to another 50 "UA sucks, UCLA sucks" posts.

SoCalCat
08-27-2003, 12:10 AM
Thats pretty accuracte and a nice post.

CatnPhx
08-27-2003, 12:28 AM
Originally posted by mtzwami
UCLA fans will then chime in.... "we have a great coach now". Well, there are very few, if any AZ fans that can't see that UCLA is on the upswing and will rejoin the NCAA elite in basketball in about 2 years.
Sorry, but don't count me as one of those AZ fans who thinks UCLA is on the upswing. What have they done since hiring a new coach? NOTHING!!!

Once they do something, then we can have that discussion. But until then (and to fulfill your prophesy) - UCLA SUCKS!!!

SnowCat
08-27-2003, 12:37 AM
>>>What have they done since hiring a new coach?<<<

They got rid of Lavin. That's something.

Show me a coach who did less with more....

Plus, with the talent there now, plus the talent coming in in 04', is it even remotely possible to be worse????

No!!!

Last year, they sucked as much as any team can suck with that talent. ('cept maybe UNC, they sucked pretty damn bad too).

They're recruiting is on the up, and their coaching already had bottomed out. I stand by saying that UCLA will be improving.
Just not this year, they'll be another double figure loss team. But that'll change.

MrBug708
08-27-2003, 01:01 AM
Sorry, but don't count me as one of those AZ fans who thinks UCLA is on the upswing. What have they done since hiring a new coach? NOTHING!!!

Kept the talent from leaving SoCal. Well, except for Bryce Taylor, who I liked more then Afflalo. He totally dominated Omar Wilkes last year

Ben Hansen
08-27-2003, 01:04 AM
Unless Arizona signs Livingston or Isaiah Swann, UA will regret not going harder after Jordan Farmar, who's going to be a star at UCLA, even though he made it very clear that he grew up dreaming about playing for Lute Olson as a Wildcat.

Does this sound like DeMarcus Nelson all over again? At least UA got Mustafa, though. Can't get much better than him.

MrBug708
08-27-2003, 01:29 AM
Shouldn't have sold your soul to Nic Wise;)

Ben Hansen
08-27-2003, 01:32 AM
I think a lot of UA fans even share your viewpoint, Bug. But having seen Nic play a ton this spring and summer, I can tell you that I think it was a very "Wise" move (wow, that was cheesy!). Nic is very, very good and has the kind of court vision that can't be taught. His outside shot is money, too.

He's so strong already that I honestly think he could play for UA this year and do just fine.

Nic's a player, no question. Jordan's a favorite of mine, though.

MrBug708
08-27-2003, 01:40 AM
No doubt he'll be a fine player and I'm sure had you gotten Farmar, it would be as a "Combo guard" and not a true PG.

Ben Hansen
08-27-2003, 01:42 AM
Originally posted by MrBug708
No doubt he'll be a fine player and I'm sure had you gotten Farmar, it would be as a "Combo guard" and not a true PG.

Haha, well what do you mean? Of COURSE Jordan Farmar is a "combo guard", so is Shaun Livingston! All guards are combos in 2004!!

Good one. I can see that you catch on quickly.

CactusPants
08-27-2003, 01:45 AM
Originally posted by CatnPhx
Sorry, but don't count me as one of those AZ fans who thinks UCLA is on the upswing. What have they done since hiring a new coach? NOTHING!!!

Once they do something, then we can have that discussion. But until then (and to fulfill your prophesy) - UCLA SUCKS!!!

Who knows whether recruits will bust or what, but Affalo, Farmer, that 9th grader, I'm sure im missing some, but Howland has made an impact for sure. As a SoCal native, son of UCLA Parent, I see alot of UCLA and know for sure that if UCLA builds itself back up, which they most likely will do, they will have first dids on SoCal bball talent. Its too good of a program and too good of a local school for many of these L.A. preps to pass up. What scares me is when Lute leaves....:(

Ben Hansen
08-27-2003, 01:50 AM
Look, there's no question UCLA is going to be able to keep a lot of the top kids at home, they SHOULD be able to, it's their freakin' backyard for Will Clark's sake. But L.A. has so many talented kids on a yearly basis that most people forget that UCLA can't get more than 2-4 in any given year (5 in rare years) because of scholarship limitations.

What people also forget is that just because UCLA will get some of the top kids in LA, it is far from meaning they'll have a monopoly on them. The state of Texas is a hot bed for talent and Josh Pastner does better there than the Longhorns, Houston, Baylor, A&M, Tech, Rice, and SMU combined. It's not automatic that kids want to stay home.

Arizona will always take kids from SoCal and from UCLA. It's just how it is once your program is established.

11Banners
08-27-2003, 04:49 AM
AZ fans are getting very bitter now! I wonder what pissed Newport off today? PMS? Mackovic? People calling Arizona's football team overrated even though they are picked to finish dead last in the Pac-10? Inquiring minds would love to know Newport!

And to the brilliant Cat who believes Howland has done nothing so far, I have a lot of real estate to sell you near the waste land known as Tucson. Farmar - Afflalo - Mata are done. Now it's on to Malik Hairston this weekend, and another big man before it's all said and done. Ya' gotta love the Terminator Howland!

jbarb
08-27-2003, 10:39 AM
before talking. UCLA didn't lose Taylor to Oregon. He would have jumped at a Bruin scholarship but we let him go.

That may have been wise or foolish, but the decision was UCLA's not Taylor's.

SnowCat
08-27-2003, 12:57 PM
>>I wonder what pissed Newport off today? PMS? <<<

Who knows perhaps a disregard for this forum? After all, there is a forum for this type of thread, and this isn't it.

MrBug708
08-27-2003, 02:32 PM
Arizona will always take kids from SoCal and from UCLA. It's just how it is once your program is established.

Will always take kids? Before Lavin you wouldnt outrecruit UCLA and now that Lavin is gone, the work has increased. Do you think if Hassan Adams were to visit a UCLA practice he'd be turned off by low lazy the practices were? Most likely not

11Banners
08-27-2003, 03:02 PM
Recruits are hearing the whispers that Lute is retiring very soon as well. Just wait until he finally retires. Ask UNC or even the Bruins about following up a legend. Ask Nebraska football. Tucson in 3-4 years will be a very ugly place. Go Mackovic!

F Duke
08-27-2003, 03:27 PM
UNC and Nebraska went wrong because they settled for coaches with little to no coaching experience. I guarantee you 11 Banners that there is a very long list of qualified coaches that would love to coach at an Elite school. Arizona is going to be fine.

MrBug708
08-27-2003, 04:57 PM
By qualified you mean someone who didn't overachieve, win a National COTY, and have sucess at more then 2 schools right?

F Duke
08-27-2003, 05:03 PM
Mr. Bug,

I wasn't talking about UCLA. I think Howladnd will thrive at UCLA/ My comment was that UNC made 2 mistakes. The first was hiring Guthridge who was too old and the second was hiring Doherty who was too young and too inexperienced. Nebraska also hired Solich who had no head coaching experience. In both cases, those teams went in family and settled for the cheaper option.

It is the common perception that Arizona will not hire an assistant coach and would rather go after a young coach with experience like Tom Creen or Mark Few.

11Banners
08-27-2003, 05:05 PM
Wow, every UofA fan should quit worrying since "F Duke" has guaranteed your AD, who hired and kept the joke of the Pac-10, Mackovic, will hire a quality coach. Nice track record he has over there in Tucson. I'll laugh when UofA hires someone like Steve Kerr.

MrBug708
08-27-2003, 05:07 PM
Dola

Jbarb, UCLA lost Taylor. He would have a scholarship if we weren't waiting on Hairston. I see it as a UCLA loss

jbarb
08-27-2003, 05:14 PM
How can it be a loss when it was a UCLA decision. They chose against Taylor, not the other way.

Again, I am not saying it was necessarily the correct choice.

F Duke
08-27-2003, 05:18 PM
There is a big difference between Arizona basketball and Arizona football. Yes, hiring Mackovic was a questionable move but he's also brought in two of the better recruiting classes in recent years so it's too early to write Mackovic off just yet.

And if you actually had any sort of knowledge of Arizona basketball and not run your unintelligent mouth, you'd know that Lute will have a say in the hiring. He wants Arizona to hire someone who can continue the legacy he started.

He's not going to allow the University to settle for someone like Steve Lavin or whatever your F-ball coaches' name is because Arizona will actually pay for someone as opposed to the geniuses at UCLA who have long been disperesed of for making unintelligent decisions based soley on money. Arizona is an elite program and when Lute leaves, an elite coach will take over. How are you guys going to do this year anyway?

MrBug708
08-27-2003, 05:32 PM
Arizona is an elite program and when Lute leaves, an elite coach will take over. How are you guys going to do this year anyway?


Which shall I answer first? What constitutes an elite coach? The boards opinion is that Howland is not an elite coach. That leaves us with somewhat of a defined list of who is elite. Give me some names of "elite" coaches.....

As for how we'll do this year, I'd say Top 4 in the PAC-10 at least with at least one win over Arizona. Lavin did it with the worse UCLA performance ever, I don't see it any different for Howland

F Duke
08-27-2003, 05:40 PM
Mr Bug, Please put down the crack pipe. UCLA will not finish in the top 4. As for my comment, you're right, I don't think Arizona will hire an elite coach.

Ben Howland is not an elite coach but I strongly believe Arizona will hire someone of his caliber with no problem whatsoever. Howland is a damn good coach but if you guys don't think you settled your kidding yourself. You hired Howland because he was the best candidate at the price you offered.

Arizona won't penny pinch and I strongly believe that coaches who are superior to Howland like Mike Montgomery (longshot)Mark Few, Tom Crean, and Kelvin Sampson (we hope not) would take the Arizona job in a heartbeat. All three of those coaches have actually won a big game and advanced past the sweet 16 with the same caliber of players as Howland so please spare me that argument. Howland is a very good coach, but you hired him because he was cheap.

1139Fremont
08-27-2003, 05:42 PM
The bRuins are far better to have to deal with than the University of Spoiled Children.

Wooden was the Wizard. Howland may be good enough to reap the benefits of having one of the most recognized programs in one of the richest recruiting environments. Or not.

Let the rivalry continue, or restart. Lavin took all the fun out of the UCLA games. Last year's games with UCLA were painful for me to watch as a basketball fan.

I hope UCLA comes back into the fray. It will make victories over UCLA meaningful for the Wildcat basketball fans.

Lavin squandered Kapono and Gadzuric. I liked both these UCLA players.

MrBug708
08-27-2003, 06:17 PM
F Duke, name one player that Howland has had better then Hollis Price? You mentioned Mark Few, yet he was our backup choice for Howland. Tom Crean would be an interesting choice, but he was the flavor of the tournament. There is one every year. It'll be interesting now that Wade is gone. He did get quality players at his program, a few Top 100 players in fact. As for Monty, he's stressed that he doesn't know how much longewr the will to coach will last but he'd like to finish his career at Stanford. He'd be a great hire because he wouldn't have academic restrictions set forth like at the Farm.

Mr Bug, Please put down the crack pipe. UCLA will not finish in the top 4


Who is that much better? Arizona for sure. Stanford because of coaching. USC, Oregon, Cal, and ASU could finish from 3-7th no doubt, but UCLA lost too many winable games last year due to the inability to draw a simple play. Howland can surely draw simple plays as he was very competitive with average players in the Big East the past year. Pitt, a team that was down in the dumps when Howland took over.

F Duke
08-27-2003, 06:33 PM
Tom Crean would be an interesting choice, but he was the flavor of the tournament

You mean he was this year's Howland? I expect Stanford, Oregon, ASU and Cal to finish above UCLA this year. In two years though, you guys are going to be nasty.

MrBug708
03-02-2006, 11:03 PM
This thread has some interesting thoughts in it...

ByJoveByJingle
03-02-2006, 11:37 PM
This thread has some interesting thoughts in it...
Not really . . . :wink2:

MrBug708
03-03-2006, 12:28 AM
Sure it does. On both sides...;)