Trevin Wade and Juron Criner?

[HeHateMe]

I don't think he was comparing Criner to them, skill wise; rather he was comparing their 40 times.

He was making a point that straight line speed is one of the most overrated factors of being a good WR. Hence the mention of Jerry Rice, Larry Fitzgerald and Brandon Marshall all running 4.6+ in the 40 yard dash.

[kylecollins]

Originally Posted by HeHateMe

I don't think he was comparing Criner to them, skill wise; rather he was comparing their 40 times.

He was making a point that straight line speed is one of the most overrated factors of being a good WR. Hence the mention of Jerry Rice, Larry Fitzgerald and Brandon Marshall all running 4.6+ in the 40 yard dash.

Exactly!

Though I do think Criner and Marshall have pretty similar skill sets, and I would not be shocked to see him have a wonderful career and even some pro bowl selections if he stays healthy and determined.

Look at Criner vs Douglas. Douglas beat him in all the speed drills at the combine. But, during a game Douglas wasn't really making anyone miss o running by/around/past anyone. Criner was though.

[BibbysTowelDude]

Jerry Rice was slow, until he had guys chasing after his ass.

[HeHateMe]

[willacat]

Originally Posted by kylecollins

So the only way to have first round talent is to be fast? He is better than most at just about everything else, and nobody is better at going up and getting the ball (which is extremely important). And its not like his speed is a weakness, or his lack of separation considering he is still going to make the catch because he knows how to use his body and arms to "shield" the defender.

Jerry Rice ran a 4.7 (greatest WR ever)

And a couple guys in a similar mold as Criner:
Brandon Marshall ran a 4.69 (2012 pro bowler)- Reminds me a ton of Criner
Larry Fitzgerald ran a 4.63 (2012 pro bowler)

Nowhere in my post did i say you have to be fast to be 1st round talent. I said he is about 3rd round talent because thats just how good he is and he's had some injuries. Criner is no Larry Fitzgerald by the way. Fitzgerald was the best player on the field starting his freshman year.

[kylecollins]

Originally Posted by willacat

Nowhere in my post did i say you have to be fast to be 1st round talent. I said he is about 3rd round talent because thats just how good he is and he's had some injuries. Criner is no Larry Fitzgerald by the way. Fitzgerald was the best player on the field starting his freshman year.

No, you did not say that. But his speed is the only thing he lacks. So, the best implication would be that you need speed to be a 1st round pick. If the guy ran a 4.4 he would have been a top10 pick (talent-wise at least).

Did I say he was Larry Fitzgerald? And, didn't I (and HHM) say it was not a comparison already, other than their "slow" 40 times? Both are the same type of players, but Fitzgerald is the supreme version. There is a huge difference between a top5 pick and and #30, by the way.

[uacats]

Greg Hansen is the only reason Juron did not go third or better.

[Pop McKale]

Originally Posted by uacats

Greg Hansen is the only reason Juron did not go third or better.

I see what you're getting at here, but I think it's safe to assume Juron's off the field issues last summer would have eventually come to light for any scouts doing a modicum of research. And it's probably something that's better to be forthright about rather than something to be papered over in any manner.

FWIW though, I'm still miffed at the manner in which Hansen dimed Juron out...not to reignite that old debate. (I see you, dc...)

[MojoJojo3155]

Juron is going to be an excellent reciever. His route running is great. He knows how to use his body to shield off a defender. His hands are elite. He has great use of his off hand after the catch.,He will make the spectacular catch. He is a smart reciever. He can do well at the next level. I just hope the Raiders recognize what he can do and use him properly.

[Kiyama]

Originally Posted by MojoJojo3155

Juron is going to be an excellent reciever. His route running is great. He knows how to use his body to shield off a defender. His hands are elite. He has great use of his off hand after the catch.,He will make the spectacular catch. He is a smart reciever. He can do well at the next level. I just hope the Raiders recognize what he can do and use him properly.

I think Juron will be a good receiver but has the potential to be an excellent receiver. I agree with everything else, but don't forget his size. He is 6'2" (without shoes) and has a 38" vertical.

I actually see him turning into a Hines Ward type of receiver, Juron is a good blocker and has the size and strength to become elite like Ward.

He turns into a good blocker and becomes dangerous in the redzone (with his size, vertical, and hands he should)... he should get a lot of playing time with the historically rush based offense of the Raiders.

[Reydituto]

Originally Posted by Life Long Cat

Love Criner. Your logic is flawed though. DUCY?

No. How is it flawed?

[97cats]

Criner had way more questions coming into the draft than he did have answers.....thats why he dropped so low.

frankly, im not surprised one bit.

[uacats]

Originally Posted by 97cats

Criner had way more questions coming into the draft than he did have answers.....thats why he dropped so low.

frankly, im not surprised one bit.

A lot of questions after Hansen cheap shot. Hansen bad for the product.

[97cats]

i honestly dont even know wht Hansen said?

my comment was regarding his inconsistent performance, oft injured body, and the inability to make it through a 12 game season.

cant make plays/impact from the sidelines.

especially not in the NFL.

however, he has talent, thats for sure.

[dc4azcats]

Originally Posted by Pop McKale

I see what you're getting at here, but I think it's safe to assume Juron's off the field issues last summer would have eventually come to light for any scouts doing a modicum of research. And it's probably something that's better to be forthright about rather than something to be papered over in any manner.

FWIW though, I'm still miffed at the manner in which Hansen dimed Juron out...not to reignite that old debate. (I see you, dc...)

Thanks Pop and I agree with you.

For one - a coach like Stoops is not going lie if a team asks him what he knows. Stoops and others said way more to the NFL then anything that Hansen wrote in the paper.

What I find really interesting is what the Raiders said and how they viewed Criner. The Raiders expect Criner to make their team and they love what he brings to the table. Personally I think he could not have landed in a better situation and like with Foles - Criner will become a favorite target for Palmer.

Criner does everything that a Heyward-Bey doesn't do. It's no longer everybody go deep for the Raiders.